In article <hcr780$a9...@news.eternal-september.org>, Bob Muncie <bob.mun...@gmail.com> wrote:
> phaeton wrote: > > Let's say a maintenance guy is replacing the the light in the ceiling > > of your kitchen. He cuts power to the kitchen (including the > > refrigerator). About how much time will need to pass before you > > should consider tossing out the contents of the fridge?
> > :-) > How retarded is your maintenance guy?
If he was a licensed electrician, he probably wouldn't be working as an apartment maintenance guy.
> 1) No power is required to be "cut" to replace a light.
I ain't working with no live bare wires. No thanks.
> 2) You let the power be cut to replace a light? How retarded are you?
The guy says he needs to cut the power, I agree. I'm not going to be responsible for an electrocution. And if I was him, and a tenant refused to have the electricity shut off, I'd take a hike. The tenant can fight it out with the apartment manager.
> 3) You have a retarded maintenance guy?
See above.
I've replaced ceiling and outside fixtures. Took about a half hour, including turning off the juice. but the kitchen was another matter. I figured another half an hour. It was a lot heavier than the old one, so maybe a little longer. Just have to figure out how to hook it to the box and wire it. THERE WAS NO BOX! Just about 10 feet of "zip" cord, running to the nearest box, draped over the ceiling joists and stapled to the last one. It was about a half day project, including a couple of runs to the hardware store to get a box, wire and hardware.
Frankly, I don't remember if the fridge was on the same circuit.
-- Dan Abel Petaluma, California USA da...@sonic.net
>> Did you use a qualified electrician? In theory, it is possible to >> change a fixture without pulling the fuse or breaker on a circuit and >> just turning the light switch to "off", but you would have to assume >> that the wiring was done absolutely to code. There should be no live >> feed. However, sometimes installers cross wires and put the live feed >> on the terminal that should be the ground wire in which case grabbing >> old of a ground wire could lead to a nasty surprise. I don't think >> that I would want an electrician working in my house who did not shut >> off off the power to the circuit he was working on. Perhaps your >> kitchen had separate circuits for the light fixture and the fridge <?>.
> Yes, he was a qualified (licensed) electrician. He said there was no > need to cut the power to the entire kitchen to replace those fixtures.
So he did cut the electricity, but only on the circuit that the light was on so it did not affect the fridge. Most modern kitchens have multiple circuits, and separate circuits for each block in an outlet, so you have to be careful if changing a plug because you can pull a fuse and kill the power to one of the sockets in a plug but the other might still be live.
> But as to the OP's original question, I doubt it took any time at all to > replace the fixtures so why worry about the contents of the fridge?
Installing track lighting or a fan light might take a little longer, but it shouldn't take more than 5-10 minutes to change an overhead fixture, a fridge should stay cool. To be on the safe side, you might wait until the fridge had cycled and would be at it's coldest.
>Did you use a qualified electrician? In theory, it is possible to change >a fixture without pulling the fuse or breaker on a circuit and just >turning the light switch to "off", but you would have to assume that the >wiring was done absolutely to code. There should be no live feed. >However, sometimes installers cross wires and put the live feed on the >terminal that should be the ground wire in which case grabbing old of a >ground wire could lead to a nasty surprise. I don't think that I would >want an electrician working in my house who did not shut off off the >power to the circuit he was working on.
I was a little surprised when a licensed electrician worked on a ceiling light fixture in my house without breaking the circuit.
(His fix to the fixture also did not last more than a couple months, so perhaps he was not the most careful worker.)
Dan Abel wrote: > In article <hcr780$a9...@news.eternal-september.org>, > Bob Muncie <bob.mun...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> phaeton wrote: >>> Let's say a maintenance guy is replacing the the light in the ceiling >>> of your kitchen. He cuts power to the kitchen (including the >>> refrigerator). About how much time will need to pass before you >>> should consider tossing out the contents of the fridge?
>>> :-)
>> How retarded is your maintenance guy?
> If he was a licensed electrician, he probably wouldn't be working as an > apartment maintenance guy.
>> 1) No power is required to be "cut" to replace a light.
> I ain't working with no live bare wires. No thanks.
>> 2) You let the power be cut to replace a light? How retarded are you?
> The guy says he needs to cut the power, I agree. I'm not going to be > responsible for an electrocution. And if I was him, and a tenant > refused to have the electricity shut off, I'd take a hike. The tenant > can fight it out with the apartment manager.
>> 3) You have a retarded maintenance guy?
> See above.
> I've replaced ceiling and outside fixtures. Took about a half hour, > including turning off the juice. but the kitchen was another matter. I > figured another half an hour. It was a lot heavier than the old one, so > maybe a little longer. Just have to figure out how to hook it to the > box and wire it. THERE WAS NO BOX! Just about 10 feet of "zip" cord, > running to the nearest box, draped over the ceiling joists and stapled > to the last one. It was about a half day project, including a couple of > runs to the hardware store to get a box, wire and hardware.
> Frankly, I don't remember if the fridge was on the same circuit.
I was having a stupid moment. When stated "replacing a light", the dots didn't connect for me and I was thinking light bulb. I've also replaced lights, installed ceiling fans, etc., and I also turn off the power at the box.
Back to the fridge question: I've gone as long as 24 hours where I currently live with the power out, and no adverse effects on the contents of the fridge. I think there are three factors involved in how long the power can be off.
1) The quality of the fridge itself (insulation). 2) The amount of items in the freezer (the more the better). 3) The ambient room temperature.
And of course, not opening the fridge is important.
Bob Muncie wrote: > phaeton wrote: >> Let's say a maintenance guy is replacing the the light in the ceiling >> of your kitchen. He cuts power to the kitchen (including the >> refrigerator). About how much time will need to pass before you >> should consider tossing out the contents of the fridge?
>> :-)
>> -J
> How retarded is your maintenance guy?
> 1) No power is required to be "cut" to replace a light.
He didn't say "light bulb", it was probably a light fixture.
> I've replaced ceiling and outside fixtures. Took about a half hour, > including turning off the juice. but the kitchen was another matter. I > figured another half an hour. It was a lot heavier than the old one, so > maybe a little longer. Just have to figure out how to hook it to the > box and wire it. THERE WAS NO BOX! Just about 10 feet of "zip" cord, > running to the nearest box, draped over the ceiling joists and stapled > to the last one. It was about a half day project, including a couple of > runs to the hardware store to get a box, wire and hardware.
I have installed a couple overhead ceiling fan lights that took a lot longer than expected but that was because I had a hell of a time getting the long screws that secure the heavy bracket into the old hardwood in the ceiling.
The worts time I ever had installing a light was when I helped my brother with alight over the mirror in his bathroom. He was replacing one of those lighting bars <?> that had 5 or 6 small bulbs and was replacing it with one that had just a round or oval base with two arms for lights and glass covers. When I removed the old fixture I discovered that it was not screwed into a box. The strip was screwed into bare plaster and the wire came down from a box further up the wall and through a hole in the wall. There was no box to mount the new fixture on.
We ended knocking a hole in the wall large enough to slip a 2x4 that we could secure to the studs on either side and mounted a box on that, then put in a piece of drywall and patched it up.
>>> On Tue, 3 Nov 2009 19:24:01 -0800 (PST), phaeton >>> <blahbleh...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>> >Let's say a maintenance guy is replacing the the light in the ceiling >>> >of your kitchen. He cuts power to the kitchen (including the >>> >refrigerator). About how much time will need to pass before you >>> >should consider tossing out the contents of the fridge?
>>> Do you plan to leave the refrigerator door open while the light is >>> being replaced? If not, remember: don't open the door and everything >>> will be fine. You'll survive.
>> It was the light in the ceiling that had to be replaced, or so the OP >> stated. The fridge really had nothing to do with the light fixture. >> That's the funny part <g>.
>> Sky
>I had the overhead light fixtures replaced in my kitchen a few weeks ago. >They were the old 1980's type fluorescent fixtures and the ballasts had gone >bad. (Sometimes the lights would come on, sometimes they wouldn't; >sometimes one side would come on, sometimes the other side. Place your >bets!) The electrician didn't have to cut off the electricity to install >the new fixtures.
>Jill
Shouldn't need too...
First, in a properly wired abode the fridge would be on it's own circuit... a "maintenance guy" indicates it's an apartment unit, would need to pass the Fire Marshal inspection for Code, so it would have had to be on separate circuit... makes me highly suspect of the OP's query.
Second, any electrician/apartment maintenance person would be able to swap a ceiling fixture live, and shouldn't need more than 20 minutes... unless while he's up on the ladder he's peeking down your blouse.
On Wed, 04 Nov 2009 08:48:26 -0600, Melba's Jammin'
<barbschal...@earthlink.net> wrote: >In article <4af18a46$0$1615$9a6e1...@news.newshosting.com>, > Dave Smith <adavid.sm...@sympatico.ca> wrote:
>> phaeton wrote: >> > Let's say a maintenance guy is replacing the the light in the ceiling >> > of your kitchen. He cuts power to the kitchen (including the >> > refrigerator). About how much time will need to pass before you >> > should consider tossing out the contents of the fridge?
>> A lot longer than it takes to change a light fixture.
>Good answer!
Waitaminit... is this one of those how many Polacks to change a light fixture jokes? LOL
Bob Muncie wrote: > phaeton wrote: >> Let's say a maintenance guy is replacing the the light in the ceiling >> of your kitchen. He cuts power to the kitchen (including the >> refrigerator). About how much time will need to pass before you >> should consider tossing out the contents of the fridge?
>> :-)
>> -J
> How retarded is your maintenance guy?
> 1) No power is required to be "cut" to replace a light.
> 2) You let the power be cut to replace a light? How retarded are you?
> 3) You have a retarded maintenance guy?
A retarded maintenance guy would be one who changed a light fixture without cutting the power to that circuit. A slightly retarded one would shut off the power to the whole apartment or the whole building to change one fixture. I suppose it may be simpler to just shut off the master breaker than to run back and forth to check that you pulled the right fuse or breaker.
Dan Abel wrote: > I've replaced ceiling and outside fixtures. Took about a > half hour, including turning off the juice. but the kitchen was > another matter. I figured another half an hour. It was a lot > heavier than the old one, so maybe a little longer. Just have > to figure out how to hook it to the box and wire it. THERE WAS > NO BOX! Just about 10 feet of "zip" cord, running to the nearest > box, draped over the ceiling joists and stapled to the last one. > It was about a half day project, including a couple of runs to > the hardware store to get a box, wire and hardware.
Lighting is a sub-specialty of electrical wiring that often (in my experience) violates various rules. Also many licensed electricians won't touch lighting circuits.
Still, there should be a box closer to a simple ceiling light than ten feet. The run of stranded wire should be as short as possible. Also, although few electricians will admit it, the only valid way to connect a stranded wire (zip cord, or what some will call speaker wire if it's thinner) to another wire (stranded or solid) is to solder it. These connections should be either in a box, or a similarly-structurally protected part of a light fixture.
>> But as to the OP's original question, I doubt it took any time at all to >> replace the fixtures so why worry about the contents of the fridge?
> Installing track lighting or a fan light might take a little longer, but > it shouldn't take more than 5-10 minutes to change an overhead fixture, a > fridge should stay cool. To be on the safe side, you might wait until the > fridge had cycled and would be at it's coldest.
Heh. Turning off the electricity for 30 minutes isn't going to destroy everything in your refrigerator, unless the refrigerator wasn't working to begin with. I have to give the OP credit for starting a thread that kept people yapping about it longer than it took for the lights to be replaced ;)
Bob Muncie wrote: > Dan Abel wrote: >> In article <hcr780$a9...@news.eternal-september.org>, >> Bob Muncie <bob.mun...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> phaeton wrote: >>>> Let's say a maintenance guy is replacing the the light in the ceiling >>>> of your kitchen. He cuts power to the kitchen (including the >>>> refrigerator). About how much time will need to pass before you >>>> should consider tossing out the contents of the fridge?
>>>> :-)
>>> How retarded is your maintenance guy?
>> If he was a licensed electrician, he probably wouldn't be working as >> an apartment maintenance guy.
>>> 1) No power is required to be "cut" to replace a light.
>> I ain't working with no live bare wires. No thanks.
>>> 2) You let the power be cut to replace a light? How retarded are you?
>> The guy says he needs to cut the power, I agree. I'm not going to be >> responsible for an electrocution. And if I was him, and a tenant >> refused to have the electricity shut off, I'd take a hike. The tenant >> can fight it out with the apartment manager.
>>> 3) You have a retarded maintenance guy?
>> See above.
>> I've replaced ceiling and outside fixtures. Took about a half hour, >> including turning off the juice. but the kitchen was another matter. I >> figured another half an hour. It was a lot heavier than the old one, >> so maybe a little longer. Just have to figure out how to hook it to >> the box and wire it. THERE WAS NO BOX! Just about 10 feet of "zip" >> cord, running to the nearest box, draped over the ceiling joists and >> stapled to the last one. It was about a half day project, including a >> couple of runs to the hardware store to get a box, wire and hardware.
>> Frankly, I don't remember if the fridge was on the same circuit.
> I was having a stupid moment. When stated "replacing a light", the dots > didn't connect for me and I was thinking light bulb. I've also replaced > lights, installed ceiling fans, etc., and I also turn off the power at > the box.
> Back to the fridge question: I've gone as long as 24 hours where I > currently live with the power out, and no adverse effects on the > contents of the fridge. I think there are three factors involved in how > long the power can be off.
> 1) The quality of the fridge itself (insulation). > 2) The amount of items in the freezer (the more the better). > 3) The ambient room temperature.
> And of course, not opening the fridge is important.
> Bob
Amazing stuff. I'm printing it now for future reference.
I should have been more specific and said "replacing the light fixture". My mistake. I was wondering why Bob suggested retardation. AFAIK the maintenance guy didn't open my fridge, but I haven't counted the beer yet.
>>Dave Smith wrote: > That said there was no reason to turn the whole house off. And a > refrigerator should never be on a lighting circuit. It's a very rare > occasion that power needs to be turned off to replace a fixture.
> Lou
Houses built on a slab are wired from the attic . Ceiling fixtures all contain a hot wire that is connected to the wall switch using a "switch leg". Both ends of the white wire in the switch leg are supposed to be colored black with a marker or something to indicate that it is a hot wire, but they seldom are. I test all wires in a fixture before touching.
>I should have been more specific and said "replacing the light >fixture". My mistake. I was wondering why Bob suggested >retardation. AFAIK the maintenance guy didn't open my fridge, but I >haven't counted the beer yet.
>Anyways...
>Thanks again.
>-J
>p.s., i'm not a troll.
I don't think anyone thought you were a troll. But it seems we all think we're electricians.
On Thu, 05 Nov 2009 08:28:08 -0600, Lou Decruss wrote: > On Wed, 4 Nov 2009 21:28:10 -0800 (PST), phaeton > <blahbleh...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>Sorry folks...
>>I should have been more specific and said "replacing the light >>fixture". My mistake. I was wondering why Bob suggested >>retardation. AFAIK the maintenance guy didn't open my fridge, but I >>haven't counted the beer yet.
>>Anyways...
>>Thanks again.
>>-J
>>p.s., i'm not a troll.
> I don't think anyone thought you were a troll. But it seems we all > think we're electricians.
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